Pat McFaddon, am I right in saying that the general election is now labour's to lose?

Well, we had excellent results, and in particular, that cliffhanger in the West Midlands that was announced last night. That was beyond our expectations and was a really fantastic result. We've come a long way in the last few years under Keir Starmer's leadership. People are looking at a change Labor Party and there's a mood for change in the country. I think these results have given us confidence and belief. But of course, a general election is a different thing, not a vote has been cast in it. I'll be the first to say to the party, Enjoy this moment, but we've still got a lot of work to do.

Is this this characteristic McFaddon gloom, that there's a parade, so you're going to rain on it?

I don't want to rain on anybody's parade. I think we should Enjoy this moment. We've worked very hard, and I'm grateful to the voters who've turned to us, perhaps for the first time or for the first time in a long time. But we know that winning the trust of the British people at a general election is a big task. It's one that we are determined to throw everything at. After enjoying this moment, we're not going to take our foot off the gas. We're not going to down tools. We are going to keep going between now and the to build on those fantastic results over the last couple of days.

Let's talk about the size of that task, because it is big. You won in West Midlands, but by the slimest of margins, your leader went to Harlow, I think twice, and said, This is a council we need to win. You didn't win it. You're actually 1% down in your share from last year. On the basis of the votes cast yesterday, our analysts are saying that you're really to about seven points. You still got a long way to go before you can be sure that you're heading for a majority.

Of course, we still got work to do, but let me respond to one or two of the things that you listed there. We just fell short in Harlow, but when I look across the south of England. We now have twice as many councils there as the Tories. They've lost three quarters of their councils in the south-east in the past couple of years. We won in Rushmore in Hampshire for the first time in decades. We gained in Thurrack. We have been gaining seats in Crawley, in Swindon, in Plymouth, across the south. There is, I think, a slightly lazy assumption about this stuff about walls, red walls and blue walls, that somehow in the South, the battle is between the Tories and the Lib Dems. It is not. It's very much between the Tories and labor, too. You might remember the pamphlet, Southern Dis comfort. I do. The Tories are experiencing some Southern discomfort right now.

Now we're both revealing our rage. But let's just deal with the scene now. Are you worried about the impact of smaller parties and independents? The Greens took quite a lot of seats away, possibly from you. And there was the gallery factor that took something like 70,000 votes in West Midlands, for example.

Look, wherever we are maybe losing support that we maybe had before, of course, we take that into account and we want to win support back. But over the piece, this was an excellent set of results for us. It's not just about overall share of the vote that you mentioned. It's about the map. It's about the seats, the decisive parliamentary seats will make the difference at the next election. I've seen Labor in the past celebrating share of the vote by piling up votes in places where we were already strong. The efficiency of our vote and the efficiency of our targeting operation made a big difference to the results over the past couple of days. And that really matters when it comes to an election.

You've clearly adopted this strategy of focusing and so on, but there's an overall feeling. I think probably The way to put this is some perspective. In order to get a majority, you need to do better than Tony Blair did in 1997, and you're nowhere near that. You and I were both around in that election. You were closer to it than I was. Does this feel like 1997 to you? It doesn't look like it to me.

It's a different time. We've got different people, different politics. I'm asked all the time, perhaps because I was around, does this feel like 1997? But I don't want for you to say, deemphasise the importance of what happened over the past couple of days, because Labor has been on a losing streak for a long time. These results should give Labor belief and confidence. Yes, we've got more work to do, but these Tories are beatable. They will fight hard. But I think there's a mood for change in the country now, and we will meet that mood for change.

Well, let's look at one of the other issues that you faced. You lost seats in the north and votes elsewhere because of some voters disaffection, particularly Muslim voters' disaffection, with your leader's initial response from Gaza. That's a point that Keir Starmer seemed to acknowledge when he spoke after the West Midland's result last night. What are you actually planning to say to those voters now to bring them back?

I think this There has been an issue in some areas, and I said this when I did some interviews the other day. We understand why people have got strong feelings about this. After all, thousands of innocent people have been killed, and there's a humanitarian impulse to help people, which we share. And where voters are feeling strongly about that, we want to win their support back. And on this issue itself, it's really important to get more aid more help to the people in Gaza because the humanitarian circumstances there are in an absolutely terrible situation. And when it comes to the general election itself, if we are trusted to govern a better future for the Palestinians, and a big priority for that area will be a big priority for a member government.

If I may say so, you've been saying all of this for a while. The misstep was originally the interview that your leader did in which he appeared to line up pretty decisively on one side. What can you possibly do now to persuade those who think that Labor has essentially abandoned, except for the words, abandoned people in Gaza to take sides with Israel?

Well, we said two things all the way through this, that Israel had a right to defend itself after the terrible events of October the seventh, but also that we wanted a better future for the Palestinian people. Those two things will continue to guide us on this issue as we go forward.

All right. One of the areas of the electric that you have to focus on is getting back in Scotland. Scotland was always part of the backbone of labor victories in the past. The SNP looks like it's going to get a new leader who has promised to reunite its party. We don't know if there's going to be a contest or not, but would you have been happier if the SNP had stuck with Hamza Youssef as a weakened, unpopular leader?

I don't think it matters who the SNP leader is now because I think there's been-Seriously?a big change. Yes, seriously. I think, let them have this if there's a contest or not. I don't think it makes much difference because In Scotland, just as in England, there is a mood for change. In Scotland, just as in England, there is a tired government and office that has run out of steam and run out of ideas. And one of the big changes that has happened, apart from the scandals surrounding the SMP in the last year, is that this issue of lack of delivery on the basic job of the government around health, education, and other services, which the SMP had shielded by keeping the constitutional issue on the boil year after year. That has now changed and people are looking at delivery, and there is a mood for change which a party that's been in power for as long as the SMP have cannot meet. The Scottish Labor Party, under the leadership of Anas Sauer, is much better placed than we have been for many, many years.

But this matters, doesn't it? Because it's been predicted by some, our analysts are saying that this is a strong It's a possibility that on the basis of the results that we've got in the last couple of days, Labor might not get a majority, but might be the biggest party. Can you imagine a Labor Administration working alongside and supported by an SNP group in Westminster? No.

You're quite right to say you've still got a job to do. That's the first thing I say to everybody after these results, we've still got a job to do. Our aim is to win a majority, to govern, to meet the mood for change, and we're not planning any alliances or pacts with anyone.

But this is part of the new labor Realism, isn't it? You have to provide for the possibility that you won't win. Let me put it to you again. Would you rule out the idea of a corporation with the SMB if the numbers led there?

Trevor, you could put it to me from now until Christmas, and my answer will be the same. We are going to aim for a majority government. We're going to meet that mid for change. We're not planning on any pact or alliances with anyone. I think after the results of the last few days, we go into that fight with no complacency, but with a belief and confidence that we've seen in the votes that were cast a few days ago.

Okay, lastly, can I just ask, in a way, a personal question, personal to me, not to you. Your colleagues have told me last couple of weeks you're ready for a general election anytime. Does that mean that over the next few months, when you and your colleagues come in here, you're going to be unveiling some actual policies that will tell us what a Labor Government might look like rather than telling us that the Tories are bad?

I think we've unveiled plenty of policies in the last few weeks. If you look at what we've said during the local election campaign, for example, we talked about how we'd revive our high streets, we talked about bringing busses back under local control.

These are ambitions. These are not policies.

We talked about building houses. They are policies. There is a myth, and in fact, I'm afraid a Tori Line out there that somehow they're the only people with a plan and not us. But I'll give you this. I do think as we get closer to the election, people do want to hear more about policies and plans for change, and we will be saying more about that because to borrow a phrase from, I think, the team that you may support, the manager of it, we're not going to stop, we're not going to down to us. We're going to keep on going after the results we've had for the last few days. You will hear more about our plans in the coming weeks.

I am looking forward to that. Patron Frienn, thank you. Thank you.