The Around the NFL podcast. Can still play the guitar. Hell, yeah, we can. 1,600 episodes in, 11 years in. We're like, Slash, coming out of the church in the November Rain video. I am 43. From the Chris Wesley podcast studio, it's around the NFL. Dan Hans is here with Greg Rosenthal, Mark Sesler, and you heard it. I've been teasing this really Basically, since the Use your illusions double album, Colleen would be on the show again, and she has, yes, returned fresh from Detroit.

You guys, I missed you. There were a couple of people on Twitter that were like, Dan really needs you to return this week. It's true.

I needed you. I missed you. We all missed you, and now you've had a return.

I don't like not being around. I miss you guys. I feel like my energy, my orbit, all of it is off when I'm not with you guys. I don't see you at least once a week. Now all is right.

It becomes clear on Tuesdays that Mark and I are not enough. We are not enough. That is not true. I think Dan, there was a moment, and I know he really meant it because it was off air, too, where he just like, this show just needs a shot of Coleen. Just really needs some Coleen.

I got shots.

Let's go. You were in Detroit.

Yeah. Speaking of shots.

Because I remember being down on the field after the Super Bowl when the Eagles won, and we'll get Maybe you get to the Eagles later. Yeah, whatever. Seeing Connie at the 30-yard line and bumping into it, you were in tears. Cut to five years later. Tears of Joy. Right. You're watching the game with diehard Lion's fan, Cynthia Freeland, and Michigan native. That must have been nice.

Oh, my God. Cynthia is truly such a Lion's fan. It was so much fun to be there with her because there were so many of her friends and family that were coming through the bar that we were doing live shots from. But then we made it in the stadium just time right before they started the game for the end of the pregame ceremony. You guys were watching the whole stadium, the way they had the wristbands and it was lighting up. It was just really cool. I looked over at Cynthia and she was just crying. This was before the game kicked off. She was already crying.

You have a neck for being present at these groundswell fan events. She's the Forest Gump. I know. They hire you to bring you to the Jets, Cleveland, other teams. Oh, my gosh. Critical mass moments.

I I really miss traveling for these games. It's been really fun because the only two games that I've been to this year have been Lions Games, and I had never been to a Lions game before. I had never been to Detroit before this year. In the span of five weeks, I've been to two games at this point. The fans that I talked to in the bar beforehand, they were so funny because they were like, We've just never been here before. Literally, we don't know how to act. We don't know what to do. They would just randomly start yelling, Playoffs. It was almost like a Tourette's type of reaction in the most endearing possible way. I met this dad who he was like, I didn't even know I was coming to the game. My daughter surprised me with tickets when I got off the plane last night. They're right at the 50-yard line. I was talking to them, and right before we left, the dad came over and he's like, I don't want to mention this beforehand, but my wife passed away eight years ago. She was such a big Lions fan, and we're here to honor her.

It was just so special for you to have us on the show and blah, blah, blah. Then I started crying. There was a lot of crying going on in Detroit. I love that. It was so nice.

I love that. I need to get Dan Campbell crying, really, to feed my soul. I think one more win. I think it's coming. We might get there. We have one more win.

Dan Campbell, I will keep this to 30 seconds, but I woke up in the middle of the night from an insane dream where I could tell something crazy had happened. Then I started, you start to remember it. I had been in my childhood house with a bunch of male bro friends. I didn't know any of them in real life. But then my neighbor's down the hill, this is my real childhood house, Dan Campbell was a teacher teaching people about the Detroit Lions. You got seven seconds left. And came up the hill and gave me an assignment to do a book report on the Detroit Lions, and then the dream ended.

Stop it.

I love dreams. What? I love Dream Stories.

He hit it right at 30, too.Dream stories.

He nailed 30. Dream Stories are the worst, but it was football-related, and it left me awake for another hour and a half trying to figure out what was happening.

I love that Dan is visiting you in your dreams.

He was like, It was large, too. It was like the real size person, the real size Dan Campbell. That's awesome.

Mark, how are you, buddy?

Are you ready for a big W at your next watch party?

Well, I haven't really thought about that, but I do want a W. You got any tips?

Whether you're cheering on your favorite team or hosting a movie night, DiGiorno knows planning a winning watch party on a budget isn't easy.

Well, thank you for that advice, man. I get the anxiety. I know my sess dog, he loves hosting, hangs with all his work friends. Everything needs to be just right.

You need the perfect setting, the perfect squad, the perfect eats, and the perfect plan to keep everyone pumped all night long.

That's what you always say, man. Perfect eats, perfect squad. That's your whole thing, keeping everybody pumped up. I like to just wing it at parties.

No, you need to draw up the perfect plan. Luckily, you're a game-time mastermind, and you know that grabbing a DiGiorno classic crust pizza is one call that brings home a W. With half a pound of cheese, sauce, and other toppings at an incredible price, it's your game day MVP. Most valuable pizza.

Thank you for all the sports metaphors. It helps a regular guy like me. I guess I'll just make the call and have it sent to the house.

It's not delivery, it's DiGiorno. Yes.

Well, thanks, Mario. That's good info.

I now understand the text that I read during that as opposed to before. I sound like I have a gun in my head.

Well, it's funny putting together a masterful bit like that and send that straight to the webbies.

A rifle to my head.

As I'm listening to it over and over again, I'm like, This is an angry read. This man is angry as he's reading it. Maybe that's why people are really connecting with it because it's so unusual for someone to read an ad about pizza from a grocery store and be furious as they I wonder if that's why the journal has not gotten back to me as I thought.

I never actually heard it. I think one mistake we make is because we wrap the show and we've got our coats on and my car started out in the parking lot. Now we need you to read an ad. I'm like, knock it out, baby. It's Thursday after the end.

It's a little.

I think if we just do it maybe before the show, you're going to get a part of me doing that.

I need you after the show for something. You need me? Yeah. That's fine. You're going to get... I'll be pleasant and everything.

But I've learned, actually, because I'm not going I don't want to sound like that on the next ad spot that I...

Well, it's because you didn't have pizza. You didn't have the DiGiorno before you had the reads. I also know.I feel like you need to really...

I feel like you need to really... They got more pop, and they just got a whole five-minute bit on the show for free. This was not a live read.

Are you ready for a big W at your next watch party? I would say this. I don't know who we're reading these ads for, but we don't see the product or payment for it. We just simply do it out of the kindness of our hearts. I know Greg is looking at Dan like, Don't say that. Don't not talk. I get it, but I've not received any DiGiorno pizzas.

I'm letting you cook. Just like that DiGiorno in the micro.

Bye. I'm done.

All right. Let's do some news. There are 70,000 plus who are screaming against him. Well, that's how many fans I play in front of, normally at my house. Pretend like they're all there, but they're zero. But right now... Tony Romo, ladies and gentlemen, didn't know what word was coming next as they were tumbling yelling from his mouth.

Sometimes you just start talking and you figure out where the journey is going to take you. I don't know who does that, but...

How many people watch that game? In Romo's defense, I guess we've all been there, but when you're doing that and In addition to the panic of, Wait, what am I saying? How do I land this? Knowing that there's what? Like 50 million people?Problematic.It's difficult.

Landing the plane when there's a lot of turbulence like that, it's really rough.

All right, let's get to the news. The Titans have a new head coach. They plan to hire Bangles' offensive coordinator, Brian Callahan. The Pelraiser reported on Monday night. He had a second interview with the team on Monday, and he's staying. He had interviews scheduled with the Falcons and Panthers for their vacant head coaching gigs, but they decide, or he decides, I I don't need to go anywhere else. I like this spot. Callahan, Mark, who had success in Cincinnati, and I think it probably helped him the way the season went on after they lost Burrow, that they remained competitive on offense. He ends up getting a gig, and that's what happens with successful organizations. They lose their coordinators.

Well, we're obviously getting deeper and deeper into the trend of just younger coaches being made head coaches. He's 39. He has already worked with Payton Manning Matthew Stafford, Joe Burrow, obviously. You can throw Derek Carr in there if you want. But he's a lifer. He's the son of Bill Callahan. It's like he's been around head coaching and around the NFL since his earliest days. I think he's a little bit anonymous just because he's not the guy who was the obvious play call or he wasn't in Cincinnati, but he's been around football forever. I was tracking some Titan fans' reaction to this, and they're fired up because I think the Mike Rable experience for some hit its wall, and you have this defensive coach who does things his own way. It feels a little bit like an attempt to modernize the Titans, bring them up to speed with other teams that are offensive-based. Good news for Will Levis. They've got the second most cap space in the NFL. But I do wonder, does this mean Bill Callahan comes over to Tennessee, too, and recreates that offensive line to work with the-That alone would make him worth it, Brian Callahan, if you could bring his dad, Bill Callahan, the best offensive line coach in the entire NFL.

He's with the So you could fire him and show him that, Dad, you're not under my thumb anymore.

Great power play, familial.

That would be amazing. Such a damn reaction.

Oh my God.

What? I guess why would the Browns let Bill Callahan do that unless they just wanted to be nice and let him work with the fun.

Or you could make him assistant.

But they did that even last year. I think they gave him a big raise. I would guess he's, if not the highest paid offensive line coach in the league. Close. People love Brian Callahan. I'm over even guessing which of these coaches are going to be good or not when they get hired because it's just the most impossible thing to predict. You made a good point that he hasn't been a play collar, so we don't know his profile too much. But we do know there are only so many of these McVay, Tree guys every year, and everyone wants one now. Zack Robinson is a guy who's getting interviews all over the place for coordinator jobs to bump up a level. Bobby Sloak might get one of these head coaching jobs. There's only a couple of them out there, and they all eventually get hired. At some point, I feel like, won't this have diminishing returns? But to be fair, it really hasn't yet. They're almost all hitting. It is an offense that's working. I think their number one objective, the Titans, was to find a coach to work with Will Levis. It really struck me, the owner, Amy Strunk, saying when they asked her what's there to be positive about this Titans team, and she went with, Oh, we have a quarterback to build around.

I was like, Oh, okay. That's how they're viewing Will Levis. I get it. He's first-run pick, but they're really looking at him as the guy, and Callahan is going to be the guy to make him better.

For Levis, it's going to be his fourth offense in four different seasons. But Callahan's offense is going to have, obviously, some similar concepts as Zack Taylor in Cincinnati, and Taylor worked with Levis' former offensive coordinator from Kentucky, Liam Cohn, for a season with the Rams, so there might be some overlap there. But the Titans always had eyes for Callahan. This was the first candidate that they requested. It was the first one that they met with virtually. It was the first person that they had in person in the building. I think it's positive that Callahan has a track record of getting good production out of an offense with a shaky offensive line like he did in Cincinnati, because that's exactly the issues that are in Tennessee with that offensive line there. Bringing him in to try and develop Will Levis. I mean, the Titans have never had offensive continuity under Mike Rable. It was four different offensive coordinators during that time. I'm wondering if not only will he bring over his dad from Cleveland, but also will they end up hiring Alex Van Pelt, the offensive coordinator who was let go by Kevin Stefansky at the end of the season, because Van Pelt previously worked in Cincinnati as the quarterback's coach with Callahan for two seasons.

Connect those dots, Connie.

I went down such a rabbit hole. I spent way too much time on this one. This is why we missed you. He worked directly with Callahan, so they're probably going to share some similar concepts. I came up with a little of potential offensive coordinators that he could hire, including-Now you're scaring me. Liam Cohn, who is the offensive coordinator at Kentucky. Then maybe they end up keeping their quarterback's coach, who is in place now in Tennessee. Just for that continuity.

Liam Cohen seems to get blamed quite a bit for the 2022 Ram's disaster.

Fair. That's fair. For what it's worth. Was it his fault? Who knows? We'll find out.

Sounds like a fall man to me, bro.

Is it Studsville? Eric Studsville?

Dudesville. I like to call him Studsville. He's been around. Former interim head coach of the Denver Bronco.

Let's not objectify the coaches, Connie.

Well, Studsville. Studsville. Was he one of the co-OCs? He was. He was the co-offensive coordinator.

Let's keep getting deeper.

Keep going. Okay, He survived multiple coaching regimes in Miami. He's been the running backs coach, the run game coordinator, the co-offensive coordinator, and Callahan and Steedsville spent six seasons together with the Broncos. There's also that connection there. You mentioned Derek Carr, by the way, how he spent time with him. To the core of the Earth. You could just throw him in, but you might remember that he helped Derek Carr reach his first 4,000-yard passing season. Look at that. Wow.

Look at that. Connie, you can leave now if you want because that's an incredible amount of heavy lifting.

I have nothing else to offer you guys. I ran out of time on the road. That was good.

That was more than we could have had.

We got to move on, but I will just throw out there. It's not a Desmond-Ritter situation, but they have the seventh overall pick, we're definitely all in on Will Levis.

We're just all in. I don't think you should be.

I think you should have open eyes. I know he had some pretty nice moments.

But just see what falls to you at seven because you can do a lot.

Which is tricky, obviously, because if you take a quarterback, he was the 33rd overall pick last year. If you take another quarterback, you're not only punting on that, you're also passing up a chance to add a major piece around him on the offensive line or as a playmaker. So I get why you probably are going to be in Levis, but not a perfect prospect. Never was.

I agree with being in on him in terms of not drafting another young guy. Add a veteran to the mix that is going to be a decent backup.

That's a good plan, too. I just have a plan. Have a I'll fall back.

This is the year for that. This is the year for that.

By the way, you know I have a tremendously close relationship with my father, Mark.

Yes, it's evident.

Humble bragg. But the idea...

We all know that. Why are you just singling out Mark?

It's like, Hey, guys, who don't really get that along with your dad, I'm going to make you feel bad now.

I'm just pointing out, if I was appointed to the top of the company and had a chance to just be like, Dad, every generation, we build. That would be my opportunity to say, Dad, we got to let you go. That's all. Imagine being at IBM, Mark, during your dad's time there, getting promoted to vice president. I think about it all the time. Being able to call your dad and be like, Dad, you can't tell me what to do anymore. In fact, get the fuck out of your office. You're gone.

I don't have fantasies like this. I don't like that.

This feels like something you personally might need to unpack a little bit more with Suzanne, maybe.

You can try to turn it on me. I'm just saying this is an opportunity that young Callahan has. I wouldn't do it to my father. I'm just saying he might want to if they don't have a great relationship.

We don't know what that relationship is. To the point of the people that he works with for six or seven years, maybe Brian Callahan just burns people out. Maybe the father burns everyone out.

Now it's power rank relationships with our dads. Okay. So, Colleen, you and Ed, unbelievable.

We are in a unbelievable race for the top seed.

I won't do that. We don't need to unpack this stuff.

You don't even inquire about the situation on the Greg and Mar side.

It'll take until the ninth month of therapy for Dan's therapist to be like, Why is it your greatest wish to fire your own father? What is this really about?

Guys, I'm bringing my dad to the Super Bowl. You'll be able to hang out with him there. We're going to go to the red carpet. Honors together. It's going to be great.We love that.Are you going to bring your dad?

I've done it four times. Who's brought their dad to the Super Bowl?I.

Have as well.

I have not. But there were extenuating circumstances around some of that.Let's.

Dig in on that.No.

Let's move on.That's absolutely not. All right.

The Chargers and Jim Harbaugh are now in striking distance of getting a deal. You know who that's from? Mike G, Mike Garafolo. You know you could trust it. The Los Angeles Chargers, after saying bye to Brandon Staley, they decide it is time to get serious.

We think they decide. It's always it's Harbaugh who's had some crazy stories over the years.

Also, striking distance is interesting.

He's been at the finish line. I'm going to give this a 90% chance. Because Mike G is implicitly putting that 10% in that report.

Jim Harbaugh, who's had great success everywhere he's gone, from college to the pros, back to college, and now coming back to the pros, it looks like, gets a beautiful canvas to work on. Maybe not the perfect charges roster, but certainly not a bad one either. And most importantly, he comes back to the NFL with a quarterback that if he hasn't quite reached superstar status yet, obviously has that potential with Justin Herbert. I think everyone that likes Herbert and is frustrated by the arc of his career so far has to be happy about this news, especially Bolts fans.

Afc West, the head coaches are going to be wild if that happens. You're going to have Jim Harbaugh, Sean Payton, Andy Reid, and then Antonio pierce, which is a wild card because you just don't know his track record. But still, those other three head coaches in division makes those division games so much more fun.

I also... I'm hesitant here to get too deep into what it all means, and I'm a little worried about this Aaron Wilson report. Who does good work for the Houston Chronicle was there. Now he covers the Texans for another outlet. He said Greg Roman would be the offensive coordinator, which is like, Greg Roman? I don't need more Greg Roman.

Not a fan of... Greg Rosenthal had never been a Greg Roman guy.

No, he's a very interesting coordinator who you can't write the history of the last 20 years in the NFL without him because he led to... That Colin Kaepernick offense was totally different than anything we'd ever seen, and he did a great job with Alex Smith, too, initially. It Could have not have crashed and burned harder. Then the same thing happened with Lamar Jackson, where it's very one-dimensional. Just imagining that, I guess I have a little bit of scar tissue. But it crashed and burned because it comes from a very...

It's speeding at a high rate before that. Look, he was the OC of that 2019.

That's what I'm saying. But then they never developed or had answers. They weren't a complete offense. But we'll see if this happens because Jim Harbaugh is different than other people. Supposedly, he was really close to getting that Viking's job in 2022. And then the Wilfs, and at some point, I think, couldn't stand being in the same room with Jim Harbaugh and all the demands he was making. And it blew up in his face, and he didn't end up getting that job. And he promised. He said, I'm done chasing NFL jobs. Never going to do it again. Right after that, the very next year, he tries to get the Broncos job. He's reported to be close to getting that job. The Broncos didn't want to hire him either. Again, after he's like, Actually, no, I didn't want that job. I'm going to stay at Michigan forever. Now, here we are again. They're close. It's like, I don't know, what is he going to demand? Supposedly, according to Mike Garrafuola, they are offering a lot of money and probably all the control that he wants. I think he found his spot that he will take, but you never know with this guy.

He's a little erratic.

Well, there is one thing, though, because the Chargers are a special team in a strange situation internally because they're in Los Angeles as the undercard always. Their stadiums are filled with the enemy fan base, game after game. Harbaugh changes that a lot. I think Harbaugh would juice up the Chargers in a way that Brandon Staley never could, anyone from the past never could. And he had to work with Alex Smith out of the gate in San Francisco and turned him into a pristine quarterback before they switched over. I think him and Justin Herbert, I don't know if I see a two or three year crash and burn thing. Although the Greg Roman thing is I thought the relationship by the end of all that was a little funky, too.

We'll see what this all happens.

But I'm not worried about Greg Roman right now at this point. We'll see what happens.

It's fun to imagine with Justin Herbert.

There's all these old Greg Roman headlines that I just pulled up from 2013. Why is his play calling holding back the Niners? I'm sure we could go and find multiple other things with Greg Roman, but the fact that Jim Harbaugh is going to be back in the NFL, it's like, I'll believe it when it actually happens.

But it will be spicy. It will be... It's great.

It'll be fun. It's great for the NFL. It's great for this podcast. It's great for the Chargers, at least in the short term, I think. Great news for Raiders fans that did not want Antonio pierce to be only an intern coach because they decide to rip that intern label off. It will be Antonio pierce, who will be the full-time head coach, Rapsheet and Mike G reported this on Friday. For sources, the team later announced it. Pierce took over for Josh McDaniels, and it was just an absolute circus there and a non-competitive, just trash bag operation, as Mark would say. Floating trash bag, as they say, or as he says, Only Mark. You're a unique man, Mark.

I mean, you're allowed to... You put those words together in the same way as well.

I can't do it the way you do it, Mark. Pierce's hiring comes after he co-to-rators to five wins in those final nine games. That, along Sestog with his very vocal, fiery style and the players latching onto him and him being essentially the antithesis of what McDaniels was, I think all that came together and got him this job.

I don't think it's just bells and whistles in terms of how the players responded to him. I mean, they were a different defense down the stretch. I think it matters. I think we're seeing this all over the place. These coaches to relate to these players in a different way. Meetings need to happen differently. There was this drum beat with Josh McDaniels of, Why is he not getting along with this important guy and this important guy? There's all these behind-the-scenes whispers that this is just not working. This is like when you have one relationship and you just go to another and you go to someone completely different. Antonio pierce couldn't be any more different than Josh McDaniels. But I think the hard work begins now because it's like, nice idea to put N'O'Neill in there for a bunch of time last year. Jimmy G is Jimmy G, and that thing flamed out. It's like, you've got to figure figure out who you're going to be because you can't be one of these teams in a power-heavy AFC with a maybe he works quarterback, maybe he gets us six wins type of guy. It's like a nice story now turns into the acid test.

We still got to find out who the GM is. Don't know that. There's reporting that Marvin Lewis will be involved in the staff, helping pierce out. He apparently actually was getting help from... He might have been staff last year, and we didn't really know, after pierce came aboard.

Like in a costume?

No. In advisory role and Tom Coughlin helping. He says he knows what he doesn't know and needs some help, maybe filling out the staff, all this different stuff. I'm curious to see what the staff looks there. Zack Robinson, again, another McVay guy, is getting interviewed for the OC job. That would be promising. I just think it should not be lost because we didn't hit it on this podcast, that Max Crosby put it out there that he will request the trade if Antonio pierce doesn't get hired. I love it. Then a day later, Antonio pierce was hired. I just think by the transitive rule, Max Crosby runs the team now. Yes, he He's the GM. He's the GM. He's the owner. He does it all. He's going to be looking at the tax receipts from the restaurants inside the... It's all Max Crosby. I love him. He's the puppet master.

He must really love Antonio pierce.

He's moving all the strings. I'm wondering I'm wondering about the offensive...

Trade me if you don't hire him?

The philosophy there, if they do end up going with a McVay guy, if it is going to still be a run first with a bunch of play-action type concepts, and if he does end up hiring an OC from McVay or Shana Khan going forward. But I think three out of their five offensive line starters are free agents, and Josh Jacobs, too. They really got to hire a GM because they have a lot of questions that they need to.

They might keep Cham Kelly who was there, too. They are letting go of the previous offensive staff, which did a better job.

I'd keep an eye on Tom Tileska. There's reporting that Mark Davis wants, because you got a rookie head coach, a GM with experience, and he's someone they've talked to. Tom Tileska, I thought he did a good job with the chargers in the terms of stockpile. Also the chargers, we didn't mention before, the second biggest cap red space issue right now of any team that league. The chargers? Yes. He left them in a bit of a fix, too. Yes.

I think the Mark Davis and company have dreams of this being the next Dan Campbell hire. Man, there's a lot of work that needs to be done. The charter is still in the same division as the Chiefs. It's good luck to Antonio pierce and the Raiders. On to Philadelphia, Connie. It looks like nick Siriani will survive the epic flame out to 2023, but he is cleaning house along the staff. Sean Desai, DC. He gone after being booted upstairs. Matt Patricia, he gone. He gone. He decides to pursue other opportunities. They got rid of the OC now. Who's the OC? Ryan Ryan Johnson. Ryan Johnson. He gone. He gone. It's that move, Connie, where they decide, what are we going to do? Are we going to fire the coach? Or are we just going to clean house under the coach and give him one more shot? That's where they're going with it.

God, what a weird-You agree with that? No. I think that the team pretty much quit on the coaching staff, whatever the main issue was, because it really reminded me of that Chargers, Raiders game, the night before Brandon Staley was fired, when the Chargers defense completely gave up. And that's what it looked like watching the Eagles trying to tackle. No one was even trying. And I know that Siriani's His record, exactly. His record with the team is good, and he was just at the Super Bowl last year, and you have players doing the Max Crosby thing, like Fletcher Cox coming out and standing by their man and really pleading to Jeffrey Lory for him to stay, I think. But watching Jeffrey Lory at that last game against the Bucks, I thought for sure that Siriani was going to be gone. That was it. So I'm surprised that he's sticking around, but it seems like he's sticking around on an extremely short leash. I don't know what happened between where the friction was with Jalen Hertz and the offensive staff as well, because it wasn't just the defense. The offense, too, was just not doing what it was supposed to be doing.

When you return nine of your 11 starters on offense and you have an MVP runner up as the quarterback and you have two incredible wide receivers and a really good tight end and one of the best offensive lines in the league, you They would absolutely be able to do more than they did.

I have a theory. What? I've been workshopping this. What if it's just all inexplicable? Football results, literally no one knows. Why did that all happen? There actually isn't a reason season, other than maybe they didn't adjust enough offensively. That's a big thing. Everyone who's into the Xs and O's is like, They just ran back the same offense as they did a year ago. But to be fair, the offense was fine until the last three weeks of the season. It It was pretty good until the last three weeks of the season. Then they joined the defensive collapse. It was like an intangible thing. I know that's what I mean, though, but what if literally no one knows? I think that's possible. I don't know why this team fell apart totally. There isn't a reason.It's.

Just the opposite of momentum.Is that possible? Is it an unsolved mystery?

Save it for the next segment.

I was thinking about that. Rosenthal?

But that is a mystery. One of the great mysteries. I think the owner-Because no one's talking.Lauri.

Just threw up his hand.It doesn't know.

We don't have any great answer. And them keeping Siriani, maybe they at least don't know the answer. So they're just like, Gosh, we...

I think they like nick Seriani.I.

Think they like nick Seriani.

They could blame it on the new coordinators, sure. That's a huge difference, but still.

That's the easy move. That's the move when you don't want to go. It's a half measure is what it feels like to me. And what happens when they start two and six next year? Not saying they will, but then you lose another whole season for a coach that you already saw. Last year, they already told you they don't want to play for him. So it's a big... I think it's a massive gamble, Connie, to bring him back when if it doesn't work next year, you're going to... There's going to be a ton of second guessing. So this is first guessing, saying, Hey, this is your fault. You lost another year here because they told you by the way they played that they were done with this head coach.

I have to look at the cap space, and I have to look at the free agents for next year, too. I don't know what type of shape they're even in.

They have a lot of big decisions to make.

Because it seemed like last year they did, and they just made it work, and it looked like it was going to be good, and Mark, it just wasn't.

I don't like teams that have their third OC and third DC in three seasons. For a team that a year ago were like, They're so consistent. Their front office is so forward-thinking.

It seems like whatever-In fairness, they lost the first two because they went to the Super Bowl.

No, but it's still a transition. It's still a transition. I feel like when Doug Peterson refused to make staff changes before his exit, that it doesn't feel like this is serious. Coaches don't want to fire their own guys, their own assistants, even with the decide thing where you want to be silly. They're loyal to the dudes for the most part. Unless they're getting fired. But I'm saying, I think it was Laurie probably saying, You're obviously on the 11th hour here, Seriani, but you got us a clean house. I think you could lose the rest of your staff by doing that. The players already have issues. It's a chaotic swirl for the Eagles in this offseason. They could look a lot different.

It all changed after Big Dom, so that might be it.

That's fair. The Big Dom did come back for the playoffs, and that was maybe their worst game.It was on the sideline?It didn't get any better. Yeah, he was back on the sideline for the play.

Why? Because it triggered it just postseason. It was just in the regular.

It didn't count in the postseason. It's ridiculous.

At least that killed that theory. You can't spend all offseason thinking, put the guy back on the-But the moment he put hands on that player is really when it began.

That's fair.

Yeah, he gets that wording of hubris.

That could be a 70-year curse, Colin. You never know what those things are.

Don't get that juju off of me.

Gross. You know who's interviewing for the Eagles defense coordinator job, among other people?

Who?

Ron Rivera. Wow. I'm just like, wow, this guy loves ball.Stays in the picture.Because he doesn't need the money, but he loves ball.

Let's spin the coaches carousel, by the way. Let's wrap this up. The Jaguars hire former... Uh-oh. This is a good transition to our next segment. They hire former Falcons DC, Ryan Nielson. He's going to run the show there. Shane Waldron lands with the bears. He's their new OC, so he's going to have a lot of eyes on him. There's two more. Then in the front office ranks, the carousel spins as well. Dan Morgan, hired by the Panthers as their GM. He was previously the assistant GM under the previous dude. Scott Fitterer. Scott Fitterer, who was fired after the Panthers went 2-15. I do have a statement. This is not Tepperby talking, but this is an episode of Tepperby, a release in a statement. Okay.

Now that works.

All right, here we go. Dan has a thorough knowledge of our football personnel and a clear vision to take us where we all want to go. We know he will attack this opportunity with the same intensity he did as a Panthers player. He was a linebacker or something.

What do you mean or something? He was one of the best linebackers of the league. I'm sorry.

Oh, my God.

Hey, if someone said that about C. J. Moseley, I would say-Stick it to me. You stick it to me. You'd get bad.

Stick it to me, Rosenthal.

Those concussions, though. He was a poster boy for too many concussions and it ruined his career.

Great. Well, that's the guy I want running my football team.

He had I'm surprised that they stayed in house, considering. Are you? Yes. I'm not. Because it's like things... Because they interviewed everyone.

Nobody wants to... I think Tepper is like, I want someone who's going to follow my orders. I mean, also, I mean, Morgan rose up through the ranks to become the director of ProPersonal, the Seahawks, during their big run. He was with the bills. I mean, he's not being pulled out of nowhere, but I am not that surprised. It didn't surprise me that Tepper couldn't go get a powerful, experienced candidate from outside in the building when he needs people simply to follow his orders.

Yeah, they did seven or eight interviews. They've had so many second interviews with head coaches that it's almost not worth listening. We'll see who they end up hiring.

I want Ron Rivera going back there. That seems perfect. He could handle it. He dealt with Snyder. He's already been in the building. He knows where the bathrooms are.

The Wadren news to me is the biggest here. Nielsen did a great job, I think, for the Falcons overall with the town. That's a nice higher for them. But the Wadren news is big because, first of all, we heard this news that maybe Cliff was interviewing for that job. I'm glad they didn't hire Cliff Kingsbury, Kingsbury's interview in around. Wadren takes that job, I think, knowing he's got the number one overall pick. I think Wadren did an overall very good job. Another McVeatry guy in Seattle the last couple of years with Gino Smith. Dave Kinalis got so much pop moving to Tampa and being the QB coach. It was Shane Wadren who was running that offense the last three years. For the most part, I think he's a good play collar. He is balanced. They were creative enough. I know they weren't incredible, but they were good. He's probably going to be working with Caleb Williams or Jake May, whoever they choose.

Then when he was with golf, golf had two of his best seasons as a passer when Waldron was the Ram's passing game coordinator and quarterback's coach in 2018, 2019. It's like, who is he going to be calling plays for? We don't know if it's Justin Fields or Caleb Williams, but they hired someone who's going to maximize the talent on that roster, and they need someone who's going to a little bit more of a balanced-They didn't wait because this coaching process has taken forever for all these teams.

It's never taken this long. They snapped up someone quick that I think would have been in all of these interviews once head coaching guys got hired. He took it because he's like, Coaching the number one overall pick, that's how I get a head coaching job next year.I think they took it.I'm surprised.

They brought in Cliff Kingsbury in a bit of trickery just to get some Kayla Williams' information. Cliff thought he was getting flown into town for a steak lunch, and it's like, We're just going to pick your brain and then send you back home.

It doesn't seem nice.

I'm sure he got a steak. Just a theory. It's not a report.

It's a cutthroat situation. Just like you call him the old man into the office.

You got a little vacation.

Handed him a cardboard box.

Dad, take a seat. I feel like based on Cliff's house... It's going to be a tough conversation. He doesn't need steak dinners to be paid for. He's good. He's talking to the stealers about their OC job, according to Peter King.

Any other Cliff Kingsbury news? We're good? All right, that's what's happening in the news. All right, what is that? Hey, what is this award that we're trying to win? One of the Shadowy League figures sent a text like, Hey, idiots, try to win this award. Plug it on the show.

This is why we know we've made it. It only matters so much to us.

It is the Sports Podcast Awards.

The Sports Podcast Awards that Caleigh Wolf has hosted. It's a UK property. That's right. We're nominated for Best American Football Podcast.

We got to win that award. Listen, we don't ask for much from the listeners, but where is that? Can you tell us, Eric, where they can go vote for around the NFL? Let's bring home a trophy. Who are we up against?

It's been a while. Europe.

Come on, as a man. That's what I want to know.

It looks like it's on sportspodcastgroup. Com.

Okay.

Then it's under the Best American Football podcast.

Just follow it for us. Let's take a chip.

I'll throw it up on all the socials, IG, so it'll make it nice and easy. We're going against Eisen over Reaction Monday, which I guess is a separate thing from his show. But Eisen's in the mix. Shannon Sharp and Ocho Cinco are in the mix. Her Huddle. If you had multiple votes, I would... Her Huddles, those are friends of ours. God bless football with Stugatz, who took some shots at you.

Sessy made it. Sesler. That's a chance to get revenge.

Neil Rettel to Jeff Reinbold inside the huddle we're going against.

We're friends with that. I was one on their five.

Nat Cooms, PFF, NFL, the fantasy footballers who we had on. There's too many people we know.

Why are we plugging them as options? Just go vote for us.

They're not options.

Dan's going to have to talk to you after the show. They're terrible.

There are a ton of options in every one of these categories, but there's obviously only one number one option.

We can't win the Overseas Best American Football Podcast.

I'm voting right now.

You know what? What I'm doing? I'm pulling a Max Crosby. If we don't win that award, I quit, okay?

I will also quit.

Well, what about... We go. What if you learn that these awards have been... This is the third year when we haven't yet... This is our first time being nominated. First nomination. What's going on? We did not win the awards previously, assuming this category.

Are you going to quit if we don't win?

No. No, that was a nice plan. He's setting it up. Well done, Greg.

What?

We're going to lose the award, and then Mark and I will quit, and then it'll be your show.

I don't want anyone to quit. Well done.I think it's all...Very.

Strategic.it's.

All good.Strategy..

All right, no, let's win. Mark and I are out if we don't win.

Did you guys vote? I just voted.

This isn't like-I'm not even going to vote because I don't want it.

Yeah, no.

Don't eat it. It's in the hands of the listeners. That's inglorious, sir.

All right.

Yes. It's like-When you lose by two votes, that's going to suck. We're gone. In fact, you know what? We're going to We're going to do the move. We're going to do the election move from a few years ago. We're leaving the country as well. We're going to Canada.

Or some other country, but yes. We'll work it out. If we're truly leaving, we're starting over, it may not be Canada.

Let's go to Mexico. Mexico. Now I'm going with you guys for For some reason.

All right. Colleen's out, too. Is that what you want? All right. Let's take a break, and then we're going to dig into some scary territory.

This program is about unsolved mysteries. Whenever possible, the actual family members and police officials have participated in recreating the events. What you are about to see is not a news broadcast.

Whenever you heard the voiceover, it was like, get out the blanket, make sure the back door is locked.

I hated it.

It is time now to explore some unsolved mysteries of the NFL playoffs and beyond. You know what, Mark? You're a big conspiracy guy. Some mysteries don't want to be solved. Then they take on a whole life of their own. Maybe that's how this ends. It's always because you always wanted at the end of the ERP with Stack and Company. You want an update and then you wanted closure.

Visceral reaction to that when that happens.

There's a frustration because we won't have any update at the end of this episode. Not that we know of, but we're going to put it out there. What needs to be solved? What's out there? What is out there? What was your favorite type of Unsolved mystery episode? I like the Paranormal Ghost Lady on the Lake type stuff.Oh.

My God, I hated that.Yeah..

I hate it. If you go because now there's the channel that has it's Unsolved mysteries nonstop.

That's channel.

There's a big problem with Unsolved mysteries in general is that they have to go recreate with typically low-level actors. It's a lot of them become unwatchable. But my favorite plot line-That made it more watchable for me, but to each their own. Well, yeah, it was variable. To me, even as a child, for some reason, I always liked the guy that was living multiple lives in different states back before the internet where it's like-That checks out. I'm just saying it is incredible micromanagement skills. But also, it was always some business guy that wasn't accountable anyone, able to have situation in Iowa, situation somewhere in Northern California, flipping back between it because all the rest is like ghost stories and murders, and it's like, cool. But that one to me was like-Weren't you so mad when the internet came and it made the world You can't do it. You can't do any. That guy doesn't exist anymore.

What happens when a family member is on Unsolved Mystries?

That happened for you?

We've talked about it on the show before.

He was on the show?

John's grandfather disappeared in Vegas in the '80s, and his family was interviewed on Unsolved Mystries because it's still a cold case. They never found his body. They found his car at the airport at McCaren. I don't like that. His name was not on any of the flight manifest. We actually got the police reports from Vegas, and it reads like a whodunit script.

I thought John was working on an eight-part podcast about this.

Well, we'll see.

I would listen the hell out of that. Oh, yeah.

Sometimes I just like, yeah, his 1988 Cadillac was found at the airport, but no evidence of him taking a flight.

I like to think he's somewhere in Mexico right now. You know what?

That would be the brighter end of the rainbow there.

You know what? The worst episodes were, I haven't seen my sister in 50 years since we were split up at the orphanage. Don't care.

Yeah, and then they reunite and just massive snooze fest. Cool. Raging.

Happy for you, but not for me. I I remember the one where it was talking about someone spontaneously combusted and just like... I like that. It shook me for my entire life. I was like, At some point, am I just going to light on fire and die? It's possible. I didn't know until Unsolved mysteries.

All right. Here we go. Let's get into it. Greg, it's time to unpack some Unsolved mysteries. Did you have anything to share? Do you ever have a family member on Unsolved mysteries?

I have not.

Nor have I. Have you ever watched the show? I have not. What? I was sensing Greg sitting back there a little bit, but that's fair.

You don't have any connection to Robert Stack?

I can't tell. I have not seen it.

I'm so disappointed. He's born age 32. He is being honest. He's being honest.

No one watched more TV than me from ages 7 to 12. I challenge you all.

All right. That's okay, though. You don't need to know it. We've talked about it enough on the show for you to be aware of the program by now. Anyway, so I'll start. Are we about in Atlanta to galaxy our way out of having Bill Belchick as the head coach? Is that where we're at? The Athletic reported It on Tuesday morning that Mike Vrabel is expected to interview for the vacant head coaching vacancy. When that happens, he will be the 14th person to do so. I love this. On Sunday-14.

He scored two touch downs of interviews.

On Sunday, with the extra points. On Sunday, they knocked out two in one day. They got Texans OC, Bobby Sloick, Detroit OC, Ben Johnson. These guys had like, playoff games. Do you think they were... How efficient could that have been? What interview could that have been?

Those take a long time, too.

Those guys weren't able to prepare for those interviews. What's the point? I don't get it. Anyway, Rooney Rule, they are all over that as well. They've interviewed six minority candidates. The only guy so far of that group to get a second interview will be Raheem Morris, and that will happen this week. That all takes us back to Bill. He has met with the Falcons twice, most recently on Friday. This again, per The Athletic in a meeting that included Arthur Blank, the owner, team CEO, Rich McKay, team President, Greg Beatles, GM, Terry Fontnou. And yet, he doesn't have the job that has been offered. Bill hasn't taken any other formal interviews. I think this would be a horrendous decision by the Falcons. I think it's a home run higher, but they're at least, because of the depth, Greggy, of how deep they're going in, it's not for show. They're really wrestling with the decision, or they've outright passed on Belichick.

According to the coaching tracker on nfl. Com, people should check that out. There's been eight second interviews, or scheduled or completed. Eight second interviews.

When does it become too much, by the way? Fyi.

Well, I think we're already there.

At one point, when we're describing it-Paralysis by analysis, when does that set in?

I think the mystery The mystery here is, does anyone really want Belichick? Because the reporting around Belichick from the outside sounds like the reporting that you would get if there actually wasn't much interest in Bill Belichick, and that his agent is using his connections to make it sound like Bill Belichick has a lot of interest. Oh, the Falcons are after him so hard. He's their number one pick. All this is happening. Okay, well, look what's actually happening. Then there's some pushback that like, no, actually, the Falcons are looking at a million people. He might not be the number one pick. It's a weird setup. Oh, there's other teams that are really interested in him, including one that's still in the playoffs. If they lose, but they're circling him, it's like, Okay, let's see it, because there are only five openings left, and they all seem to be circling different people. I think the mystery, or possibly the solution here is that Bill Belchick doesn't really have that big of a market.

What if he doesn't want it? What if he is the one who is lukewarm on coming back? What if he wants to do a Sean Payton type year and just take a time out?

Then he would have interviewed twice for this job, though.

But to your point, maybe- Maybe he's on the fence, though. Right. Maybe even they did want it, but he doesn't want to be reporting to Rich McKay. That's the setup there, whatever the setup is going to be. Right.

Belichick, I think, is probably very driven to get that Don Shula mark beaten. I mean, from one angle, but from another angle, they really certainly, they characterized it not as an interview with Arthur Blank. They talked. I think a lot of it is Belichick saying, Look, I don't care who anyone is. I'm the greatest coach around. Maybe not in those words, obviously, but here's how I structure my front office. Here's how I've been doing things. I've been doing it for 20 plus years, and the results speak for themselves. If you're going to put up blockades and make me, at my age, change and do things in a Falcon's way when the Falcons have nothing to show for it, this doesn't fit for me. I could see it where he is peacefully saying, I could wait a year, or I'm not going to jump into the wrong situation. We don't know what the Falcons presented to him.

And the Raiders went after Tom braided a few years back, and then the Bucks got him, and there wasn't a huge market for Tom braided. Otherwise, I think this is that same thing all over again, but with a head coach. Take a chance on Bill being more motivated than ever and getting the greatest, most successful coach in NFL history. I think it would be a huge mistake by the NFL on the level of the Lamar Jackson situation. If you let this hiring cycle go by and everyone ends like, No, he's not going to be for us.

Yeah, but Lamar Jackson wasn't coming off of two awful seasons.

Well, they weren't high-level seasons by his standards.

No, they were bad.

He did a bad- Then he got hurt both years and missed the end of the season.

Oh, Lamar. I mean, Lamar was playing well. My point is, Bill Belichick did a bad job at what his job was the last two seasons. It is a, what have you done for me lately?

You can say that about Tom braided. It's all relative, But he was a guy that appeared to be in decline the last couple of years there.

Even there, those guys are playing at a level that's much higher than the average performer. I would say it's fair to point out, Belichick did not coach and run that organization in an average way the last two seasons. That's the thing. Between the Patricia year and what have you.

But this is my point. My point is, if people are going to look at how the end of the Patriots run went after Tom braided left, I think you're overth it when you have an opportunity to give him a fresh start. Listen, go hire some 37-year-old offensive coordinator that's never been a coach. Be the Raiders and hire a guy, an Antonio pierce, that was an interim coach that was coaching high school the year before. That's all cool if you want to do that, but the idea of talking yourself out of Belichick, I think it's a possibility of a huge thing.

I think when you've rooted for a team where you've never had a Belichick or anything close to him as a coach, your mind's going to like, Why not take a shot at this?

To the point you made earlier in news, it's not even a trend anymore. It's the way it is. Everyone wants to get the young guy now, and it's like you want him to almost be the face of your organization. I think that's one of the reasons my team, Robert Salas, still has a job. They like the way he looks. They like the way he presents himself. And Belichick is a 72-year-old frumpy guy that's grumpy with the media and all that. Maybe that's part of his problem now, too. He doesn't look the part the NFL has changed.

Well, and what is his plan? Because there was reporting from Washington Post.

Grumpy and grumpy.

That his staff could include Josh McDaniels, Matt Patricia, and Joe Judges. Oh, my God.

But I think that's a little concerning. Absolutely. You think?

Yes. I can't deny that. All right, Connie. Okay. Give us an unsolved mystery of the NFL.

Okay. This is a team that has given up 400 yards in three straight games defensively. They've given up 94 plays of 20 plus yards this season, which is the third worst in the entire league. They've had six different quarterbacks throw for over 300 passing yards against them, and only the Jags defense was worse this season. But the lions are still in, and their defense is just such a mystery to me because their run defense is incredible. They've only allowed one 100-yard rusher this entire season, and it was a quarterback. It was Justin Fields. The most a running back had against them in a game, 69 yards. That was Ty Chandler in week 18. Ty Chandler. Their run defense is awesome. Aaron Glenn is getting all sorts of head coaching interviews. The players absolutely love him. They just do one thing really well, and then everything else, they're just mediocre in or bad in. They're bottom 10 in sacks. They're the middle of the pack in total yards, bottom 10 in points allowed, middle of the pack and takeaways. How are they doing it? How is this working?Lions magic, baby.That's what I don't understand.

I think offense being more important than defense is that. In the end, you got to be You got to make some plays on defense, be opportunistic situationally. Look at the 49ers. The 49ers defense played terrible against the packers until they didn't in the fourth quarter, and they made a couple of plays. But before that, they were getting run over. Even the Bills, I mean, the Chiefs defense, that was their worst game of the season. They get through. That would be my-Yeah.

This last game as an example, they forced Baker into two interceptions. One, stopped the opening drive led to points. The second one, Mark, ended the game. They're opportunistic, and their pass rush has gotten better. Hutchinson has been on a tear the last couple of weeks. I guess it's maybe the numbers don't tell the full story of where the defense is right right now in this moment under Aaron Glenn.

Or they just have that magical thing.

Or maybe they do, and they'll have... But I'll tell you what, Markey, they're going to be tested in a big way at the big bell bottom on Sunday.

Yeah, and I think it comes down to the end, and they gave up 20 points to the Cowboys, 20 to the Vikings, and that started their playoff run after that, 23 to the Rams, 23 to the Bucks. They generated some turnovers. Aiden Hutchinson has been playing. You're getting the best version of them. I think the lines are just a different type of story where they're winning Close games here, but there's just something about the team that I think under Campbell that's like, We are deficient in certain ways. We understand it. We're still a team that's being built. A lot of their draft picks hit so hard. I think that's why they've leveled up in one extra play-off game than maybe they would have. It's like next year, this offseason, you amp up the defense to some degree, but they're surviving. But they're not giving up 45 points a game here and having to win shootouts at the end of the season here like they were last year. Last year was like, We've got to somehow score 38 points and give up 37. It's a little bit different textually in terms of what they've done in the last three or four weeks.

They come up with some big plays. Yes, they gave up a ton of yards last two weeks, but you think of the stops, the negative plays they forced the Rams into to get them out of field goal range. Last week, so many times, the Bucks get across midfield, and then Baker gets fooled by a blitz scheme that Glenn cooks up. It's like to bend but break defense. But you're right. The next two weeks, if they get to play two more games, they're going to have to win shootouts.

Greggy, an unsolved mystery.Debating.

Between two.Tough..

Always tough.

Yeah, but this team doesn't get a lot. But that's what the showrunners of Unsolved mysteries had to do, Greg. So you do understand how the production.

And they came to stack with the rundown. He's like, Get this out of my face. Rearrange.

Smashes a bottle against the wall.

Like whiskey. What does Jason see this Bucaneers team being? A monster. That's my mystery. Because I think he's sneaky done a good job with this team, drafting, keeping it together. They've really hit on their drafts better than almost any team in the league over the last six or seven years. They've been pretty good. Mike Evans is a free agent. He is going to cost an incredible amount. You could franchise tag him. That would cost a lot on your app. Levante David is a free agent. Baker Mayfield is a free agent. Antoine Winfield, I would argue, is your best defensive player, is a free agent, and David might be second. So maybe you're two best defensive players. Heck, even Chase McGofflin is a free agent. Just a lot of pieces. A kicker. They'll say goodbye to Devon White. But the biggest part of all this is, how much do you really love Baker? Because I think when you mentioned the Geno Smith type of contract, you were probably right, Dan, of like, that's what it's going to take to-That's what his agent is going to want. That's what he's going to take to prevent him from going in the free agent market, which would be something like $25 to $30 million a year, and then maybe 40 total guaranteed, where if you really wanted to give up on them after one year, you'd have to eat it a little bit, which is what the Geno Smith deal was, which was what the Derek Carr deal was with the Raiders, actually, not with the Saints.

Do you want to do that for Baker? Are you willing to spend all this money because they have a lot of cap space on Evans and these other guys and actually move on from Baker?

Yeah, I think Baker worked partially because it wasn't quite to the level of Tom braided landing there, but this was a better roster than people. I mean, the roster around him. People around him. People thought, wrote the Bucks off as a five-win team, and a lot of it was like, Well, Baker Mayfield feels like a placeholder. You got at least, I think, the second best season of Baker Mayfield. It came at the right time in the playoffs, the whole thing. It worked, and it's a nice story, but I think the teams have to be really, really careful of nice stories. I'll give you another Brown's example when they went 10 and 6 back in the day with Romeo Cronnell and Derek Anderson. As that season came crashing to a halt and they missed the playoffs, you could see through it. It was like, well, and what they did was, because they had never had that success, was they reupped Romeo Cronnell in a monster contract, reupped Derek Anderson, brought in a bunch of half baked free agents, and they were being talked. They were given the most primetime games in the league, and then went on the worst scoring drought of any team in like 45 years or something.

I think if you're the Bucks, you have to be self-scout and say, We were in a terrible division, wrapped inside a conference that was going to make it easy to go through a trap door into the playoffs. But don't deceive yourself. Baker might deserve to stick around, but don't annoy him as the starter yet. I'd say, look in the draft, look at competition, but also give him credit for what he did.

Even Mike Evans, as great as he is, is going to be 31 next year and is probably going to... Does he even fit better on a team that can just give him $60 million over two years to try to go win a Super Bowl? You know what I mean? Versus having to pay that much money in Tampa. This is off topic.

Is Mike Evans a Hall of Famer?

I think he's probably right there now because it's been so many years. What, 11 straight years?

He feels like one of those guys that's going to be slowly... He'll be a semifinalist for five years, and then at the end of his thing, it'll be like he'll get into the room and he'll be on the border. One of those guys will have to wait forever because he doesn't have those all pros.

Wide receiver, it's so tough, too.

He doesn't have those all pros.

I think you mentioned the Browns as an example that year. Chet said the same thing with Ryan Fitzpatrick after he had a great season out of nowhere or a good season out of nowhere. It's very easy for these middling teams that are maybe a ball bounce the right way and you win a playoff game to talk yourselves into, Oh, let's bring the core of this team back. And then it's like, Well, this team actually isn't that good. They won a bad division decision. This is a lot of the core players from the Super Bowl team from three years ago that are continuing to get older. You could make a case, which is weird because you're coming off a team that was just in essentially the quarterfinals of a Super Bowl tournament, to blow the whole thing up. You could do that, too. It might not be the wrong decision, which typically you don't say about a defending division champion that won a playoff game, but they are in a weird space where they could go two ways.

Imagine if Antron Winfield hadn't done that play against Carolina, where he knocked the ball out at the half of our line in week 18. The Bucks didn't score an offensive shutdown in that game, and the season had ended there.

Mike Evans has my vote, Colleen. Not in the Superstar Club, but the Hall of Fame.Wired.That's weird. He occupies a very weird unsolved mystery of his own, in my opinion.

It reminds me a little bit of Reggie Wayne, but he didn't get as many primetime games and stuff like that, but occupied a similar space.

Yeah.

Andre Johnson, he's in the Hall of Fame, right?

I mean, Andre Johnson, to me, is another level above, but yes.

Then Tom braided aside, the quarterbacks that he's been with, Mike Evans has been quarterback proof.

That's a big argument for him, I think. Absolutely.

He would have better numbers if he had a better quarterback. Mark.

Mark has a lot to choose from.

No, Mark told us he had 27 different... Big old database, Sets Dog.

23 of them were...

Coking up that DiGiardo's in the brain.

I want to know. I think the Eagles collapse. When something like that happens, you forget about the second biggest collapse sometimes, right? It's like Eagles became such a big story, and they were part of our flashpoint. But what about down in Miami? A team that absolutely was torn to pieces by most winning teams in general, but the Ravens exposed them in every possible way. I think that launched Lamar Jackson and ended the MVP race right there. They have a critical game at home against the Bills that they lose, and the division floats away. The early season luster and the idea that Mike McDaniels, who was an incredible press conference guy, had some hand or secret over the rest of the league when they were scoring 70 points on the Denver Broncos back in week three, goes on from there into inclement conditions in Kansas City. The offense never shows up. The defense gives the Chiefs one of their best offensive performances of the year. And you now march into an offseason, this team that looked like they were going to soar to playoff wins, with the second worst cap situation in the league. And I know that you can say all these things are just solvable, but they are $58 million in the red.

You have got The flock of free agents, Jerome Baker, Connor Williams, your center, Christian Wilkins, Andrew Van Ginkle.

These guys all sound like they're going to get murdered with this music.

Van Ginkle is a character I am convinced that you've made up.

I'm going to find him in a barrel.

Andrew Van Ginkle. I love Van Ginkle. I think he's, through two coaching staffs, he's been a difference maker for them.I.

Love him as a player.All right.

They've got three or four offensive linemen who are free agents. They already were really short at wide receiver. As soon as they lost Waddle, it looked like they were exposed at that position. They have to start Start over at that position, essentially. All the backup guys are gone, too. Start over. Well, I'm saying just beyond your two stars. You lose one star, and they're not the same team.

And the other star needs to get paid soon.

That's right. You've got problems. I am just saying also that you are in this place where you can look at Tua, and I understand that he's one of these guys. It's like the people that are pro Tua, you can paint any picture you want. But I can't repaint the picture of what happened to him down the stretch and in that playoff game. It's like, I I just feel like he's a quarterback, and I have my own thoughts on Tua where he's very capable, accurate. There are good things about him. It's not to put him in one box, but do you trust him in the biggest NFL moments that your team is going to encounter? I think we've got a sample size where the answer is no. You are Mike McDaniel.

This is an epic setup.

You've come out of the belly of Kyle Shanaher, who for a decade plus has had an intense man crush on Kirk Cousins.

Oh, this This is all leading this.

I'm just wondering, do you just sit there with Tua? Because I would say one thing about Mike McDaniel. He has gone as far as he can to build up the confidence publicly of Tua. He has been his supporter verbally from wire to wire. I'm just saying that someone like her cousin's other options in the world, if you're Mike McDaniel and you feel like an inflection point of like, We can't just repeat this same season where you walk into the playoffs and get waxed in cold weather. How do you change things? What is Mike McDaniel's next move?

There are a lot of questions you asked there.

I appreciate how thorough that was.

That was deep. That was good.

I want that entire thing on Instagram.

Well, welcome to the Fish fry. I've been here for a while, and the seat's right next to me.

I also appreciate having you not have to take every bullet from that fan base. They've got to have open eyes, and it's not just...

They did not have open eyes, and their offense went into a funk last year, too, that people looked away on and just said, Oh, two was hurt, and all this stuff. I got to see if that offense is functional when it's not Super Bowl September in Miami. Yeah, there's a lot of work to be done there to see them as a real contender. I don't need to add anything else because I was saying it all year.

It was the same questions that we had about this team, and they showed us the answer in the most important and biggest game possible. We weren't sure how they would play against good teams, and we definitely weren't sure how they would play against good teams on the road. Then that's exactly what happened. That was the concern all season long, and it came to fruition.

I think defensively, there's a lot to be excited about in They can keep most of their people year two of Vic Vandieu. That was really showing dividends before the injuries struck. But everything you said is really well positioned, Mark, because I think they're in a very difficult spot where they have a lot of challenges. To keep this team together in very difficult decisions to make, and yet they have these high expectations, and yet they haven't really achieved that much. It might be the most difficult spot you can be in. It's like...True.You know what I mean? The expectations are high, but there's a chance it could all crash in really tough decisions, but you actually haven't put any playoff wins in your pocket. It's a tough spot that their GM Chris Greer and their coaches in.

I like McDaniel. We all like McDaniel.

Right.

Some of us love him.

Some of us adore him.He's.

What makes it.I'm not going to work there today. I think they can avoid it falling apart, but I think in terms of their roster, they have as many questions as anyone.

Ugly ending to the season for sure. All right. I think that's good. I think we're good, right?

Yeah.caleen.yes. Dan.

Are you attending Super Bowl 58?

I am.

Are you still going up in that fighter jet?

Oh, my God. The Thunderbird? Yes, I am.I cannot wait.I don't like it.

Is it you and one other pilot?

Yeah.

You're not playing Gunner. I'm not saying that you'd be shooting in Gunner. You don't play a role. You're just a passenger.

I'm just a passenger, but there's five hours of training and medical medical assessments I have to go through first. How do you train to be the passenger? If I have to eject, I have to eject.Okay..

I cannot wait.I've been falling down some YouTube worm holes lately.

About the Thunderbird?

Just about everything and my algorithm is out of control lately. I was watching a 26-minute video about the mechanics of the Titanic sinking, and then that spit me into some different Then it was sent me to, Here's a 96-year-old World War II pilot. A guy who can barely walk. He's ancient. They load him up in the old fighter jet and After showing a whole real montage of able-bodied young people passing out due to the G-force.

I know. I'm really worried about it.

Then Gramps is up there, and no effect. No way. Gramps, the veteran who has who had been in many battles. Then all I could think was calling him into the office and being like, Gramps, I'm taking your wings. You're fired. Get the fuck out.

Jesus.

Because that gives you a chance to really get one over on him, too. You were like, you've got some lineage issues, but it is making for good listening.

Have you ever been a boss of people that you could potentially fire?

Not yet, but I'm looking forward to the opportunity.

Maybe hoping that doesn't happen, though.

But it's a lot of family stuff that I think Especially a grandfather, if you can...

I respect you. It's like a godfather fantasy for you, where you're like Al Pacino in the bathroom finding that pistol. Is that what it is?

I respect you, but...

Ego.

Yeah, I'm worried about passing out.

I think you will, I guess, is what I'm going to say. I know you've flown before.

Oh, I've flown before.

Many times, right? . But you've never gone G-force.

I did my ground school for my pilot's license. I got not all the hours I needed for my If it didn't solo. But I've been up there, and yeah, I've never pulled Gs before. But when I was talking to the pilot, I said that I was worried about passing out and/or throwing up. Really don't want to do either one of those things. She was like, Oh, I'm not worried about it. Women's bodies are more physiologically capable of handling the Gs. Usually, when people throw up or pass out, it's men. I swear. I was like, I'm sorry, can you just say that one more time? You dropped down.

What if the man is 60% G?

Oh, my God.

I was sitting on that for 10 minutes.

So, yes, I'll be at Super Bowl. I'll make it to Sunday as long as that flight goes okay on Tuesday.

Not only is everyone counting on you, including your war veteran father? That's right. He flew missions.

Yeah, he was stationed at a missile silo.

Now, all the women of humanity are counting on you, too, to keep up the reputation of G-force.

It's a lot of pressure, but I'm ready to handle it.

I like that you harbor spontaneous combustion fears, but also jump into this assignment.

I'll jump out of planes. Let's go.

Good stuff. Thank you, everybody, for listening. We will be back on Thursday. Title game, Thursday Preview. That's a big one. Got to cook up some guests for that.Spicy.Thank you, Connie.Yeah. Heed the call.Yeah.Heath a call..